You probably won’t see this in the paper but we had another gang fight between the Bloods and the Crips last weekend. One of the participants was injured enough that he had to be flown to FFX hospital. Last I heard he was in a coma. This is the second incident between those two gangs in about the last month. Let’s hope that it doesn’t escalate to gun violence.
We also had a failed drug deal on Monday afternoon where the guy on the losing end wound up being shot twice. Evidently the guy got robbed by his dealer. My friends on Facebook are having a field day with this one. They’re the ones who titled it “Welcome to the Jungle”. They opening stanza of that song is becoming more and more accurate:
“Welcome to the jungle, we got fun ‘n’ games
We got everything you want, honey we know the names
We are the people that you find, whatever you may need
If you got the money, honey we got your disease”
See this earlier post about the first gang-fight.
In a bit of mixed news, one of the gang-bangers who killed an OHS student last year in a gang-hit-gone-wrong is currently on trial. According to the paper, he has admitted that he stabbed the kid. Let’s hope the Commonweath’s Attorney gets this one right and doesn’t cut a sweetheart deal as they have done with other high-profile cases lately.
Does anyone still believe we have too many police officers and need to face the problems as they lay or am I just cranky today?
March 21, 2012 at 11:34 am
We just need to do a bit more embracing, understand that everyone does not come from the same place, and or has the same goals. We should explore how we can paint more fences, grow some veggies, and expand social services. That will make it all better, Mr. Cranky.
March 21, 2012 at 12:42 pm
He pled guilty to first degree murder and gang participation. That doesn’t sound like a deal to me. He couldn’t be charged with capital murder. Hopefully he’ll receive a very long sentence.
March 21, 2012 at 1:35 pm
AGAIN…security is BAKED IN…Not bolted on! HELLO?!?!?! Anyone home?!?!?!?! You probably have MORE security on your computer (relatively speaking) compared to MCity. Some people don’t get the whole security thing…as if they’re “giving” up if they hire more police. GIVING UP HELL…YOU ARE FIGHTING BACK! Why do you think we have a strong military. They need to think of our police as THE MANASSAS MILITARY…without a strong force you are VERY vunerable! Stepping off my soap box now.
March 21, 2012 at 3:56 pm
Way to go, Nettie!
March 21, 2012 at 3:56 pm
This gang stuff is very scary. I worry about innocent children…mine namely…getting caught in the crossfire. If Miguel was truly not gang involved, then he was a victim of the crossfire…so it could be any of our kids. Yes, yes…I am for more police!
March 21, 2012 at 4:26 pm
Bloods and Crips…Bloods and Crips. Everytime you write a comment on gang activity, it is always those two. You releasing on a public blog information that is not officially released for some insider info ya got?
You forgetting we also have MS 13, Sur 13, 18th Street and SSL? Or you just have a thing for those two L.A. born gangs?
Where is the outcry over the increase of rapes? That is the #1 incident in 2011 accrording to our Police Chief. Followed closely by Domestic Violence which is also up.
End of my being cranky.
March 21, 2012 at 4:48 pm
Both Beverages are cranky about this post actually.
I had a longer thing but decided to scrap it in favor of just saying read the MCPD report: violent crime is down, officer initiated activities are up, arrests are up, and looking at it I’d say things are getting better overall. Personally I feel like there’s just been more attention paid to certain incidents which causes a perception that things are worse then they are.
And where pay tell is the outage over everything else in the City? Look at the MCPD’s P2C system. This week so far there’s been a DUI, a larceny, many drug offenses, and quite a few domestic situations. Last week there was even more drug offenses, more domestics including some labeled “ASSAULT & BATTERY -FAMILY MEMBER” and “VIOLATE PROTECTIVE ORDERS”, one “INDECENT LIBERTIES WITH CHILD BY CUSTODIAN”, an embezzlement, some “DESTRUCTION/DAMAGE/VANDALISM – PROPERTY” incidents, and one “PORNOGRAPHY/OBSCENE MATERIAL – SOCIETY” for whatever that is related to. There’s also several drunkenness, robberies, larcenies, and a “THREATS TO BOMB OR DAMAGE BUILDING” listed for last week. Less then two weeks and all those offenses have occurred, few of which are reported on and that don’t make the blogs. You want to see what really goes in this so-called jungle, just study the incidents on P2C!
Domestics are related to much of the violent crime that occurs in the City and pretty much every other place and yet they receive less outage then stuff like drug deals. In fact, did you know you’re most likely to be hurt or killed by the people you live with or even just know? Where is the worry over domestic violence which affects more people both physically and mentally then drug deals and gang members ever do? Believe or not, the chances of your husband/wife/boyfriend/girlfriend/other significant other killing/wounding you is higher then anyone else killing/wounding you! I don’t anyone where expressing outrage that!
March 21, 2012 at 5:06 pm
Crime does seem to follow illegals, low income, etc, etc.
March 21, 2012 at 5:42 pm
Hate to see overgeneralizations about illegals all the time. Crime seems to follow low income, alcohol, drugs, and priests. Ooopps another overgeneralization…
March 21, 2012 at 5:52 pm
D,
I’m not sure of exactly how many illegals buy fake ids and or stolen ids in order to appear legal, but that’s just one crimianal activity they engage in. Then you have the people, many times themselves illegal, making the fake ids and or stealing real ones. Many times, because they are illegal, they are victims of crimes. There is nothing positive whatsoever about even having a single illegal in the Community.
March 21, 2012 at 8:24 pm
COM,
I do agree with you that it is difficult to identify anything positive about illegal aliens in our community. However, beyond the city’s tougher code enforcement attempting to keep a lid on overcrowding and other nuisance issues, there isn’t much we can legally do to identify them until they are arrested for crimes and checked out. That, I fully support. Yes, illegal aliens are indeed breaking the law by just being here. But I don’t know that there is anyone who can identify an illegal alien with any high degree of certainty just by looking at them. No more than I can instantly tell that someone is a jerk or simply unworthy of representing me on city council or school board. Until I hear them speak or read what they publish, that is. Then it becomes obvious. If only it were that easy with illegals. More big ticket lawsuit settlements is not what Manassas needs right now. We can’t be utilizing extra legal means to root them out, because as I’ve always heard it, two wrongs don’t make a right, and some previous actions have already cost the city dearly in cash and reputation . It was better when people just thought that the Bobbits lived here.
March 22, 2012 at 5:47 am
D,
You would be wrong about being able to single out illegal aliens. Well, yes in a way you are right that it was better when we just had the bobbits, we did not have illegals who came to the City to commit crimes that impacted the entire City. What the Bobbits did, was just a crime against each other. So, I will take a City full of Bobbits any day over a City full of dirty illegals any day. We can pass E-verfy, we can enforce school enrollment laws and regulations. It’s never wrong to go after criminals, unless of course one has a soft spot for them. And talk about cost, the cost of not doing anyting is far worse than the cost of doing something. Or, have you not noticed the City can’t seem to attract the right type of family, businesses, etc? A legal way of going after illegals, have weekly unannouced DUI check points, because the liberals complained about the Police not checking every car that enter checkpoints, the Police now have to check everyone. That means everyone has to produce a license, registration, etc. How many illegals do you think are going to want to risk being stopped at a DUI checkpoint?
March 22, 2012 at 9:58 am
On the illegals: Our Police Chief, in his annual report to the Council, was asked about them and, as noted in his report (see page 4), out of 2,943 “Foreign Born Commit”, there were 1,304 ADC 287(g) detainers. 44% – at least when caught, the local system works.
March 22, 2012 at 10:28 am
So are the ‘clean’ illegals folks we should worry about less than the dirty illegals? I’d concur with that, depending on how you define clean. I can look at a guy who hasn’t washed his clothes and agree he looks dirty. But I can’t look at the same guy and know his residency status.
Enforce school enrollment laws and regulations. Which do you mean, how could we go about it, and what results would you expect? Anyone?
Law enforcement dragnet? Are we willing to pay the cost of that type of particular ‘something?’ I’m curious as to how the police force would respond to that type of request. And our legal council as well.
March 22, 2012 at 12:01 pm
The Bobbit’s lived in Prince William County.
Criminals come from all social classes. The smarter ones just usually do it with less violence but it is still behavior destructive to any societal grouping. The harm needs to be judged on the merits of the case. Is a family that comes here illegally, gets jobs, buys a home, car and shops in the local stores while paying the appropriate taxes more harmful than the native born citizen who commits burglary, theft or worse?
It is easy to lump illegal aliens in to a group whose only goal is to take. I do not want open borders but a lot of people come to this country for a better life for their family.
Gangs do not always equal illegal aliens. All gangs should be targeted equally. A Hells Angel is as dirty as a MS13 member or a Crip.
We could hire hundreds of officers but at what cost to other services that the City needs to supervise such as roads, waterlines and sewers. We need the cooperation of the people living in all neighborhoods to stand up and report crimes when they see them. As long as the culture of not talking to the police is encouraged, crime will prevail. The police are not the enemy but they also need to recognize that they are part of the community and be careful of their presumptions.
March 22, 2012 at 1:09 pm
Well, the police currently conduct “all way stops” in GTS where they setup on an intersection and stop everyone. Obviously that’s very time intensive and there’s a practical limit to how much of that you can do before everyone gets sick of it. The point is that we *are* doing some of that. We’re also doing foot patrols. Can we do more of all of that? Possibly.
In my view, the real wildcard is what to do in other areas of the City that need this sort of attention. When you look at a “heat map” of crime in the City, it’s largely in GTS and on Stonewall Road in POW. We’ll need more officers to offer that same level of attention in those other areas. We can’t do it on an overtime basis as that budget is far too low to cover much more than “city events” (4 of july, etc) and we can’t “de-staff” our GTS efforts or we’re just squeezing the problem to a different place….
March 22, 2012 at 1:11 pm
@Scott – you’re right, the community has to be central to our efforts and we’re getting much better at that. The problem that we’ve had is turnover in the PD. I belive we’ve got a handle on it for now but it’s going to take some time before everyone become familiar with one another.
March 22, 2012 at 1:37 pm
Speaking of welcome to the jungle, I walked out of our house to morning to the sight of three officers “gearing up” for something.
Scott, Do you think it’s ok to rob banks in order to have a better life? What crimes do you not support in order to have a better life? Do you excuse crimes committed by non illegals? I don’t care if they come here for whatever reason. If they are here to work, they are breaking a number of laws, either not paying taxes, using fake or stolen social security numbers, which if stolen is a huge cost to the victim. All illegals are breaking the law in some form or fashion, and so yes they should be all lumped together. I don’t see too many people who defend native criminals. And, besides it’s a stupid comparison, since illegals are not even supposed to be here in the first place. And, illegals are not supposed to be able to buy homes, so that’s even more law breaking going on. In fact, many of the homes that went into foreclosure were the result of illegals.
Yes all gang members are bad. However, maybe you can help me out here, but when was the last time an elected official made excuses for the Hell’s Angels. Or made excuses why people join that gang? MS-13 is pretty much a majority illegal alien gang.
You are right about many crimes not being reported. The fault lies with the illegal, who because they are here illegally will not report the crime. So, who suffers the most? Usually a member of the family of the illegal alien, who rather than do the right thing, provide cover for the illegal and associatted criminal actions.
The suspect in the recent Capitol Building was an illegal, who up to this point had just minor traffic issues. So, it does not matter how minor the crime is that they may committ, it’s all the same. Even some of the September 11 hijickers were here illegally.
D,
When students are enrolled in schools and they do not have a birth certificate, and maybe even a copy of one, those are to be reported to the police for follow up. I believe that’s a State law. However, that’s not be done here enough. So, that’s one way to target illegals in the school system.
It’s not a drag net to keep the community safe, not only from illegals but from drunk drivers.
March 22, 2012 at 1:51 pm
Those stops we do in GTS yield wanted felons, drugs, you name it.
March 22, 2012 at 2:16 pm
Andy,
Thanks for the information. That’s a good policy to have in place for high crime areas. If it makes a difference, then the people who live in GTS, who claim to want a better neighborhood should fully support such programs. Or, they can just keep seeing the police there in response to crimes that have already happened. Either way, the police are going to be in the neighborhood until it gets cleaned up.
March 22, 2012 at 3:02 pm
COM: Never said that robbing a bank was ok. Can you honestly say that you drive the speed limit the whole time? I would rather have someone trying to better their life as neighbor and/or co-worker than someone that would cause harm to another person. Heck I am not sure if both sides of my family came into the country legally, as far as I know the maternal side may have wandered down from Quebec to NY and the the paternal side may have just walked off his ship in one of the northern ports. Both prior to 1900. Law Enforcement has only so much resource. Would you have them stopping the bank robbers and gang bangers or being the housing authority?
I do think that if one is caught doing something illegally than immediate deportation is fair unless a jail sentence is mandated, then deport. Excuses are made for bad behavior every day i.e. “he had a rough life”, “society is to blame” or one of the other sort of excuses that alleviate the criminal of his personal responsibility.
One size fit all is not the best of solutions.
I have lived in the City for 44 of 46 years. I have seen it change but one constant since the late 1970’s has been GTS. Even before the influx of hispanics, it was a rough neighborhood. When I worked for a land surveyor, we would go in there early in the morning because the bad element was usually asleep.
March 22, 2012 at 3:09 pm
@Scott and other long time Manassas residents,
It’s my understanding that GTS was once a desireable place to live. What happened?
March 22, 2012 at 3:26 pm
GTS started out as a bedroom community for young professionals and their families in the early sixties. I lived there from 1965-1972 so my memories are limited to the time there since I was only 6 when we moved. I do remember being able to play in the playgrounds and not having any sense of worry. As the young professionals moved up in their jobs and their families grew, many moved out but retained the property. Those properties became rentals which went to lower income families over time. A lot of renters feel very little ties to the community. The drugs and their problems followed. As the properties changed hands from owners to owners who was just buying them for the income, the HOA fell apart. Properties values declined and there was no one care for the property until the city stepped in with the substation. Years of decline will take years of rebuilding.
March 22, 2012 at 4:47 pm
Any comments about white collar crime?
March 22, 2012 at 4:55 pm
Scott,
But, coming here illegaly for a better life and breaking a number of laws are OK? But, robbing a bank is not? Sounds like the typical illegal alien supporter argument to me. And, yest GTS was bad prior to illegals, but did the City attempt to clean it up? Or did they just say, well some in there are just trying to have a better life and not do anything about it? At what point would you want to lock up an illegal or deport them? After they’ve broken two, three, four laws?
I never said the police should turn into the housing authority, but they are tasked with follow up on no birth certificate cases. We have other employees to do that.
March 22, 2012 at 6:34 pm
Sorry about the incomplete sentence…. We have other City employees to check on overcrowding.
March 22, 2012 at 8:58 pm
@Doug, about White Collar Crime: well, we have our share of that occuring, although small numbers and not often reported in the paper unless big – like the S.W.I.F.T employee who embezelled over a million bucks. There are arrests for fraud, counterfeit or forgery. I am aware of a couple of cases in the last year of our Seniors losing money either to some scam artist over the phone, or falling for the “Nigerian” letter scam. Overall though I think for the City, we might be on par with a general look at other Cities and Towns of comparable size for White Collar stuff.
March 23, 2012 at 9:16 am
COM: How would you allocate the resources of the police? Immigration is a federal matter for the most part. Should every traffic stop result in an immigration check? To be fair that would have to be done on everyone? Would not want an illegal from England to get a pass check because of his ability to communicate with the officers.
You keep implying that I support crime. I do not. I do believe in allocation of resources. But since you seem to be one note on this issue, we will have to agree to differ on the approach. Have a good day, sir or ma’am.
March 23, 2012 at 10:06 am
Ray,
White collar crime requires hiring individuals who are able to detect it and understand it. Before I came to Manassas I worked regularly with individuals who had worked in law enforcement and intelligence services from around the world on white collar related crime, and I can tell you right now we’re less equiped in Manassas to detect and deal with white collar crime than we are with gang related crime. Of course, the other issue one needs to familiar with is that both areas can be intertwined.
March 23, 2012 at 11:31 am
Scott,
Yes, I do think every time the police come into contact with people, they should inquire about immigration status if there seems to be a chance a person could be an illegal alien. The Police have to adjust to crimes and criminals, some types of crimes that are happening now, were not an issue ten, twenty years ago, but are now. That does mean they just throw their hands up and say they can’t handle it? They adapt.
Of course I’m a one note person on this, I do not like crime, any crime, and I do not like to make excuses for it, or to take it easy on some based on where they came from. I do not support any crime. I do not acuse you of supporting crime, just that you seem to make excuses for why we just need to put up with it, right after you say you want to do something. It just sounds like you are talking out of both sides of your mouth.
March 23, 2012 at 12:09 pm
Andy,
What would be the cost if every traffic stop involved a background check? How do you tell if someone is here illegally? Accent? Clothes? Skin Color? How long does it take to process each of these incidents? How many more jail cells can we build to hold them? Would we need to have subjails in the subdivisions? I am sure some of the commentators here would not be NIMBY’s and open their homes to house while the Federal Government processes them. What happens when the police cannot respond to serious crimes?
I do not talk out of both sides of my mouth but realize that crime needs to be triaged just like a serious accident. Do you spend the first few minutes with the guy with broken arm, then the one with a black eye or the one with the sucking chest wound. All need to be checked and cared. The situation with illegals needs to be resolved. I do not believe in amnesty but we do not have the means to deport all at once.
March 23, 2012 at 12:37 pm
First bear in mind that everyone who ends up at the ADC has a check run on them. Second, bear in mind that ICE has TOTAL control over who they will put immigration detainers on. Currently that process is reserved to serious crimes or (sometimes) people who have many misdemeanor infractions. Don’t argue with me. Don’t crab about it. It’s like complaining about gravity….it isn’t going to change b/c you don’t like it. I certinaly don’t like it but it is the way it is.
Now, could we run an immigration check on every person our officers come in contact with? Sure. My guess is that you’re looking at 30 min/stop? That’s a guess but a traffic ticket takes 15 min. and that’s probably just a wants and warrants check.
Given the above, I don’t see where it makes much sense to do all of that. If you stop someone and they’re illegal with a clean record there isn’t anything we can do. ICE will not take them and we don’t have the room (or probably even the authority) to hold onto them. I see little point in taking people in that ICE will immediately cut loose. Additionally, if we start doing stuff like that ICE may elect to boot us out of the program.
If the wants and warrants check comes back dirty then they’re going to jail anyways. At that point, an immigration check will be run.
March 23, 2012 at 12:59 pm
Doug, agree with you on white collar crimes and hiring someone who is trained in being aware, knows how to educate to prevent it, and knows how to ferret it out. In the CoM Family Services Budget, there is the 3-year position to fund (50% State/50% Local) for a Benefits Fraud Specialist who would not only do Medicaid, but also across the board with the other benefits programs. Lots of white collar benefits ripping-off occuring across the Nation, and this puts a Specialist right in our DFS to check and monitor. Neat thing is that the Virginia Benefits Fraud Program allows for either in whole or a percentage of money that is “found” in the reviews/investigations/etc. Well, at least at the moment it can come back to the City, but you never know what will occur with the GA changing the game plan.
March 23, 2012 at 1:24 pm
Ray,
Slots are great but unless the person hired is truly qualified and capable of doing the job, we have nothing except a patronange position to hand out. I’m not a big fan of government keeping the spoils of their work. It can introduce a conflict of interest into a fraud or law enforcement department which has the potential to turn the pursuer into the pursued with no one to do the pursuing… translation – not a good situation.
March 23, 2012 at 2:40 pm
Scott,
Who said anything about deporting them all at once? Agian, you are using typical language common among illegal aliens supporters or apologists. Nobody said anything about the rate of deportation. Ahh, yes, you bring up serious crime vs crimes committed by illegals, as if an illegal driving drunk and or without a license is not a serious crime, or one that has stolen a social security number, though I would suggest anyone who is a victim of identity thieft would not consider it to be a non “serious” crime. The cost and time associated with cleaning up the mess is not a joke.
And of course you bring up jail space. Of course in your zeal to prove a point, you’ve admitted(without realizing it) that we have a huge illegal alien issue, because you state we would need many more cells and many more police. If a person does not have a license, provides a fake name, etc, which is a common activity of illegals, that would in my opinion and many others including law enforcement be grounds to maybe do an additional check on the person. How often are people who are stopped, get asked about warrents, etc? A stop might take a bit longer, but if it results in one more illegal being taken off the street, that would be a positive.
Andy, the 287g program just lost funding because our current administration is more interesting in the safety of illegals than it is in the safety of Americans.
If everyone is checked for warrents and wants, then suspected illegals should be checked for immigration. That’s only fair. But, as you said, we are hamstrung by the Feds. However, there are ways to make life a bit more difficult for illegals, and we should instrut our police to do a better job. If word gets around we are serious about cleaning up the City, illegals will leave and or not come here in the first place. Agian, there is a reason they came here, and not another community. We need to fix that. Otherwise, all the talk about improving schools, attracting new developement, etc will be just that.
March 23, 2012 at 3:30 pm
Some people read things into statements. I have never apologized for illegal immigrants or supported their rights.
How do you suspect someone of being illegal? Is there some criteria? If you went to an establishment and thought someone working there is illegal, are you complicit if you purchase something there and/or do not report your suspicions? Would that make you a supporter of illegal immigration since you are providing them an incentive to work? This would apply to anywhere you shop not just in the City.
Serious crime is serious crime if commited by an illegal alien, a felon on probation or someone commiting a crime for the first time. I make no distinction. I would rather the cops having the resources to do it all but we do not live in a society that has unlimited resources unless we borrow or tax more. How high should the tax rates go up for your utopian society? Whom should we borrow from? Bt emphasizing on just the illegals leaves all of us vulnerable to the other cretins out there.
March 23, 2012 at 3:41 pm
COM: PS I do not remember in any of my previous points stating we did not have a problem with illegals so I did not admit to anything without realizing it. This discussion would not be taking place if there was no issue with that. I wish the Feds had been doing their job.
But in your opinion of me, I support illegals, like bank robbers, identity thiefs and drunk drivers……lol. My main concern is emphasis on the allocation of resources. You cannot spend more than comes into the coffers
March 23, 2012 at 4:02 pm
Scott,
You asked how many jail cells would we need if we locked up all the illegals that came into contact with the Police. That’s an admittence that you’ve made without realizing it, that we are overrun with them. We are lucky to have a resident of the City, who is a former high ranking INS official, and he has said more than once he can tell who is an illegal and who is not by a simple process. Maybe he can share that with the Police. Maybe you’ve heard of Help Save Manassas, they list not only companies that pledge to not hire illegals, but will also when they have knowledge post information on companies that hire illegals. We just hired a business to do some work around the house, the first thing I asked the owner was if he hired day laborors, since most if not all day laborors are here illegally, otherwise they could go to manpower instead of hanging out in the 7-11 parking lot to get work.
As I’ve said, the police have to adjust to crime as needed, twenty years ago, there was no such thing as internet based crime. Using your logic, the police would be too busy to investigate such criminal activitiy, since it’s not been around forever. Nobody needs to do anything extra to curb our illegal alien population. I would hope the police pull over anybody they see making a traffic infraction, or any other crime for that matter.
I might come across as a bit rough, but I’m sick and tired of the issue, and have heard every excuse in the book about how we can’t get rid of this issue. Yes, it’s hard work, but more importantly it takes will and a can do attitude to get it done. We can no longer afford to have the crimes committed by illegals, or otherwise that have happened over the last few years. The majority of murders that have occured in the City the last few years have had illegal aliens involved, either as the victims or suspect. I do not think we need a utopaian society in order to get a handle on criminals.
March 23, 2012 at 4:04 pm
Citizen of Manassas, you are right to push these issues, and to ignore the continued excuses for inaction by Scott and the others.
The City Council could pass an E-Verify law tomorrow. Although the only punishment (at the moment) could be to deny violators a renewal of their business license, it is a place to start…to send a signal to employers and illegals that the citizens are on the move. But, this City Council blames ‘the fed’ and does nothing.
Can some City ordinances be passed to impound cars if there is no valid driver’s license? Or if the driver is illegal and is not the registered owner, or, or…? Or some kind of confiscation laws, like RICO, if there are drugs in the car?
What about checking the homes of illegals who are picked up for drugs, and interrogating their relatives?
Why doesn’t the police department check the registered addresses of the cars that drop off carloads of kids every day at the school bus stops? ‘Stealing education’ is a crime if they don’t reside in the City? Verify that those students are legal residents of Manassas? Why don’t the police stop cars with out-of-state plates which show up at the schools every day? There are cops on campus. Once upon a time the chief told me he can’t do it…”because it’s the school’s problem.” Out-of-state plates are not the school’s problem.
Why doesn’t the police department follow up on students who don’t produce original birth certificates, as required by Virginia law? When I did an FOIA on this several months ago, the police department said they only had three (3) during the beginning of 2012 academic year. The various schools contradicted that! They reported to me 13, which used affidavits (which in themselves are an unverifiable joke)…plus most schools did not even report the use of photocopies of birth certificates.
Why don’t we at least count the number of illegal aliens in town, once they are picked up, or enroll in school, or….in a dozen different ways? and post an on-going summary on a website? Why? Because everyone hides behind ‘the law’ and pretends it’s a violation of the law to even identify illegals or count them. But when I inquire, no one produces any citation of those laws. In the schools they usually they cite Plyler v. Doe, which only says students in a jurisdiction must be educated, and is silent on anything else.
If I am elected to this School Board I will see what laws can be implemented by the school system, and who can be prosecuted for not enforcing the laws.
Oh, by the way, Scott, the illegal aliens are the infantry and foot soldiers of the gangs…because they can’t get legal jobs. Haven’t you figured that out by now? Not just the ethnic gangs, but the Bloods and Crips.
March 23, 2012 at 4:27 pm
COM and Mr Sutherland, I do not get where you think I want inaction. The tone deafness of your arguements is ridiculous. What is this simple process of identifying the illegals? I would support that. There are plenty of people who came over as the first generation legally and grew up in enclaves of fellow language speakers who never learned English. How would you seperate them truly illegals? You keep talking about tools to do that but like a politician you keep repeating your arguement and labelling.
COM you have not answered the basic question on to pay for the mass expulsion of illegals from the City???? Your logic in claiming that I would not want internet based crimes is facetious. How does allocation of resources mean that I do not want certain crimes investigated. By your logic you would also be saying I do not want crimes involving cars investigated because they did not exist until after the constituion was ratified. You seem to put all your effort against one target, the police can not work with blinders and be solo issue.
Mr Sutherland: You need to read my post before you state that I call for inaction and lump me in with anyone else. As a candidate for office with a lot ideas I agree with, you should be careful of making assumptions. The School Board and City Council should both see what they need to do to verify legality of the students and citizens. I wish you luck in your run for office.
March 23, 2012 at 9:29 pm
Scott,
I brought up the internet example, because you claim the police can only focus on a limited number of crimes, and that somehow focusing on illegals would prevent them from other crimes. And, once again, your excuse was shot down. I’ve given a few examples of how one can determine if there is a good chance a person is illegal, no license, giving a false name etc. Yet, you are so intent on not accepting those examples, you just gloss right over them, because at the heart of it, I do not believe you care if we have illegals or not. Anyone who has lived in this City for the last ten years should be just as determined as me and others to come up with a way to get rid of illegals. They are killing this City. Do you realize how much better our quality of life would be without illegals? Less money spent on schools, lower tax rates, lower crime, better schools, etc. Instead, you just want to throw hands up and say well, we just have to put up with them rather than work at coming up with solutions. What does language have to do with this? Again, you bring in issues that are not being discussed in the context of this thread. You claimed I wanted the police to be the housing athority, I said no such thing. Now you bring language in the issue, and how can we tell who is illegal or not based on langauge. Again, you just keep bringing up excuses as to why we can’t do something, rather than come up with ways to do something about it. And, then you wonder why people believe you are an illegal alien supporter.
By the way
March 23, 2012 at 9:32 pm
By the way, there was an accident involving a police car on Grant Avenue and another vehicle. Witneses say the gang unit was in the area at the time of the accident. Now, there is a helecopter flying around the City. Welcome to the jungle, indeed.
March 23, 2012 at 9:40 pm
Scott,
Here is what I would do, take all the money we spend on social programs and redirect that money to the police, and back to us taxpayers. Having no social services will drive off illegals, and not give them an incentive to come to the City. I would eliminate all on street parking in Wellington(for example on Hood, Cloverhill etc), Point of Woods,, etc. That would cut down on multiple families, and or groups of people, living in the same house. That would not cost the City any money other then the cost of the no parking signs and paint for the roads. What are your ideas?
March 23, 2012 at 9:44 pm
It sounds like a war zone in our City tonight. But people like scott will just keep making excuses.
March 23, 2012 at 9:48 pm
Nothing like another fine night of Gang activity and fighting in GSouth! One policeman and cruiser out of service…sounds like we need more now!
March 23, 2012 at 9:52 pm
Nettie,
We just made it on the local news. Ya… Can’t wait for the people to show up to say we just need one more ball field and more buses for the B&G club. It’s time to take our City back. Tell the people in GTS they have thirty days to move before the bulldozers come in and knock it down, all of it.
March 23, 2012 at 10:06 pm
It does sound scary tonight with all the sirens and helicopters. Reading posts on insidenova/fb…says a lot of people being detained…I hope they arrested tons of thugs tonight!
March 23, 2012 at 10:10 pm
Michele,
We can only hope that is the case.
March 23, 2012 at 10:33 pm
COM: Once again, you keep insisting I want nothing done. Just a single note on your own horn. If the police have probable cause then that person should be arrested. Reducing the vehicle parking would have a good effect.
I suggest the police and public works should go door to door and if any illegals are located the house should be demolished immediately. That should help the city tax base by reducing the number of students out.
Social services should be cut also. The means testing for that should have citizenship contingency to even qualify to be reviewed.
I hope the officer is ok but I refuse to rush to judgment unlike our president until the facts are known.
March 23, 2012 at 10:40 pm
Scott,
Now are you putting up some ideas. That’s a start to coming up with solutions. Some may work, some may not, but doing nothing is the one sure way of not taking care of the problem.